<quote from Real Faith & Reason>
We need to define our options for thinking more clearly. We can choose demonic influence. We can choose the ungodly thinking trilemma. Most people know of this as Münchausen trilemma, and this trilemma offers a choice of the axiomatic thinking fallacy, circular reasoning fallacy, or the infinite regression fallacy. However, we can also choose divine revelation. We’re now thinking of our options as five choices: demons, axioms, circular reasoning, infinite regression, or divine revelation. Only divine revelation can give us truth.
Up to this point, we’ve focused considerable energy on a true premise. However, even given a true premise and valid form, there’s more to truth than a true premise and valid form. Truth is spiritual, and logic without Jesus Christ is futile. He is the Logos. A person can repeat a creed without knowing Christ, or a Christian can use logic to defeat an anti-God thinker in a debate, yet this Christian may not know Christ. To put it in explicit terms, this Christian may never acknowledge Christ’s voice or allow God’s grace to do God’s works through him or her. But Jesus said, “These people honor Me with their lips, but their hearts are far from Me.” Perhaps we’re all guilty of this error sometimes, and yet God leads us forward in Him if we cooperate with the Holy Spirit. Jesus is the Truth, and God has hidden all knowledge and all wisdom in Him.
Let’s consider one more conversation.
Rocky: “Godless thinking ends in irrational thinking. Godless thinking doesn’t need a premise. It uses assertions.”
Sandy: “You went to debate school so you can distance yourself from a conversation with logic. Is that a premise or an assertion?”
Ungodly thinkers who are trolling the Internet don’t necessarily make sense. The remarks about debate school and logic don’t make sense, nor do these remarks relate to anything that came before them.
Rocky: “You wouldn’t know since every time you try to reason beyond your immediate sensations you have to do so based on made-up stuff. That’s not a slam. It’s the result of the Münchausen trilemma. It’s the fate of every ungodly thinker.”
Sandy: “You refuse to learn anything about biology to support your claims, and I am not going to write a term paper for your edification.”
Now, Sandy brings up biology, which has nothing to do with the discussion. With Internet trolls, they may just be copying and pasting comments from a document of trolling posts without regard to the discussion.
Rocky: “As I said, you wouldn’t know since every time you try to reason beyond your immediate sensations you have to do so based on made-up stuff. That’s not a slam. It’s the result of the Münchausen trilemma. It’s the fate of every ungodly thinker. Are you bringing up biology because you want to discuss the stories of evolutionism? You aren’t equipped to discuss those either since every time you try to reason beyond your immediate sensations you have to do so based on made-up stuff.”
Sandy: “Ok. Now you are just repeating yourself word for word. I am not reasoning from my own senses. I was saying you could open your eyes and look around every once in a while. But nobody’s ever seen DNA with the unaided eye. We interpret the results of DNA testing with our eyes, but the math is there whether we are looking at it or not. No circular reasoning there. So yeah, scientific proofs require further proofs, but not ad infinitum. Science being based on previous science doesn’t make it axiomatic, it just means you have to learn the other previous science it rests on if you can’t take it for granted, but you are unwilling. No trilemma there.”
Rocky: “That’s exactly the problem. You aren’t reasoning from your senses as you say. You’re trying to reason beyond them. That’s why I said that you wouldn’t know since every time you try to reason beyond your immediate sensations you have to do so based on made-up stuff. If you understand this problem, you’ll stop arguing. As soon as “science” goes beyond observation, it’s either based on made-up stuff or divine revelation. If you have science based on previous science, you can’t base the previous science on stories, or you base it on made-up stuff. So, godless stories do fail because of the Münchausen trilemma. They’re irrational. Give that some thought. Think about it. See if you can understand it.”
Sandy: “Perhaps it would help if you defined made-up stuff.”
Rocky: “Stuff you make up. Like fabrications. Axiomatic thinking fallacies. The Münchausen trilemma would destroy all reasoning if Münchausen were right. It would destroy all science. However, Münchausen made the mistake of assuming the myth of naturalism. He assumed only a natural world and a natural mind. He’s right that you can’t prove anything if you assume naturalism. You can’t prove that observation, logic, or science have any value. You can’t even prove your existence. However, God reveals that observation, logic, and science have value. All you lose is the ability to think beyond your senses. You can’t think beyond your senses without divine revelation. So, you can fry an egg. You can invent a cell phone. But you can’t rationally guess how much of that ability comes from tinkering with what your senses tell you and how much God reveals to you. You can invent a new microscope or telescope to improve your capacity to see. But you can’t rationally extrapolate from observation to a story about evolutionism or millions of years. You can’t rationally talk about right, wrong, God, philosophy, or anything else that you can’t sense with your five natural senses.”
</end quote>
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